My fellow YGO forum friends, with the help of YouTube, I discovered a VERY useful card to combat the infamous Dracossack!

Reptilianne Vaskii:
http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Reptilianne_Vaskii

Dark, Lvl 8
ATK/2600 DEF/0

This card cannot be Normal Summoned or Set. This card cannot be Special Summoned except by Tributing 2 face-up monsters with 0 ATK from anywhere on the field. Once per turn, you can select and destroy 1 face-up monster your opponent controls. There can only be 1 face-up "Reptilianne Vaskii" on the field.

This card is the bees knees against a first turn Dracossack if you manage to have one in your opening hand. Well, it's good at any time they have Dracossack out, but usually the go first turn with it, and will give you amazing advantage first turn since it costs nothing for you to play. Tribute the tokens, pop Dracossack, then if you're playing E-Dragons yourself or Mermails, OTK the sh*t out of them. That extra 2600 ATK on board is a HUGE contribution as well, allowing an OTK to be even more viable.

Unfortunately it is a terrible main deck card, and if you are going first round 2 and side it, you might not get such a chance to sack their dracossack since they might be expecting it if they know of it, or if they simply want to OTK you. Choosing to go 2nd if you lost round 1 though, might actually be a viable option.

three words:

"compulsory evacuation device"

works great against any XYZ/Synchro/Fusion monster and is already a staple. (for me)
oh and veiler also laughs at dracossack and kicks butts in general. (tho, i don't run that one in most of my decks for some reason)

one thing to keep in mind when siding vaskii: you can't call it (him/her? idk) out if your opponent chooses to activate dracossack's effect to destroy one card. (half the time i see dracossack being summoned during the Main Phase 2)

Compuls is a main deck card, and it isn't always going to be there for you since it's a 3 mst and heavy storm format. I'm talking good side deck material, and like I said, it's good for countering their first turn set up. In a duel with E-Dragons, you can pretty much determine who's gonna win within 1-3 turns, and they aren't necessarily going to be poppin' sh*t so early if you don't have much committed to the board. Getting the advantage early with Vaskii is a huge set back for them in my opinion.

e-dragons would just summon another rank7.

i was able to rummon 2 big eye's, 1 dracossack and 2 rulers...after my opponent destroyed my first dracossack and big-eye...

also, a common first turn for e-dragons is: dracossack, 1 ruler, LaDD - no tokens.
which (surprise, surprise) is no threat for spellbooks btw.

so yeah even as a side-deck card, there are better counters for dracossack. vaskii is just too specific.

would be cool tho, to see the opponents face after he summon dracossack, summons 2 tokens, no set cards and ends his turn while you have vaskii. :moonie:

edit: well, if you're running alot level 8's in general and having 3 trade-ins in your deck, then he might be worth it in your side-deck.
if you can't beat dracosack otherwise...like with "mind control" or "big-eye"...or idk my dracossack never survives even one round.

slightly off-topic:
from all the duels i had since MST is at 3, all i can say is, that it used to be a solid staple, but now, it's nothing more than a minor annoyance. (unless you're deck is dependant on permanent spell/traps)

today's format is all about monster effects mainly.

wauwi wrote:e-dragons would just summon another rank7.

i was able to rummon 2 big eye's, 1 dracossack and 2 rulers...after my opponent destroyed my first dracossack and big-eye...

I could make the same argument against compuls... What good is it if they'll just make another one? compuls alone isn't gonna do anything, just like Vaskii wouldn't. Vaskii is an out to Dracossack, then you play other cards to counter the rest or OTK them, and with an additional 2600 ATK on board from Vaskii, it wouldn't be difficult.

my main argument still counts: veiler and compuls are also good against other cards than dracossack alone.

for what would be a vaskii good for if you draw him without any dracossack/tokens on the field or what if you draw it instead of card which you actually would need?

unless your deck runs trade-ins, a dracossack, ojama trio or any other multiple 0ATK token summoning card.

without support, vaskii alone is too much of a risk in s game where luck is a big factor.

well that's just my opinion...i play cards where most people would call me a noob for, so. :/

wauwi wrote:unless your deck runs trade-ins, a dracossack, ojama trio or any other multiple 0ATK token summoning card.
without support, vaskii alone is too much of a risk in s game where luck is a big factor.

That's why you side Vaskii, no?

Vaskii in my opinion still remains better then your two options. You'll mostly see e-drags summon more than 1 dragosac then you can use vaskii.

while compuls and veiler and 1 million other dracossack killers are useful even after dracossack is longer on the field or wasn't even summoned, vaskii isn't.
there are so many anti-dracossack cards in pretty much every deck anyways...either fiendish chain, chalice, compuls, veiler, big-eye, mind control, solemn, BTH, torrential, constellar pleiades, verz ophion, and so on...
unlike vaskii, all those are generally useful.

the regular e-dragon user usually tributes the tokens to summon LaDD - during the first turn.
also, if you manage to get vaskii out, unless you OTK, he/she's on the opponent's side the next turn, because of big-eye. so against d-rulers, you can totally forget about vaskii.

with veiler, you can prevent the token summoning and the LaDD, even before you've made even your first move.

i admire your outside-of-the-box thinking tho, but vaskii is nothing but a fun-to-use card...nothing useful...like all reptillianes. (that's my second-favorite archtype, btw, but i'm a realist...or pessimist...? who knows the difference of that lol)


TL;DR:
siding a card specifically to counter ONE SINGLE card never was and never will be a good idea.

This card is good for side nuff said

wauwi wrote:while compuls and veiler and 1 million other dracossack killers are useful even after dracossack is longer on the field or wasn't even summoned, vaskii isn't.
there are so many anti-dracossack cards in pretty much every deck anyways...either fiendish chain, chalice, compuls, veiler, big-eye, mind control, solemn, BTH, torrential, constellar pleiades, verz ophion, and so on...
unlike vaskii, all those are generally useful.

the regular e-dragon user usually tributes the tokens to summon LaDD - during the first turn.
also, if you manage to get vaskii out, unless you OTK, he/she's on the opponent's side the next turn, because of big-eye. so against d-rulers, you can totally forget about vaskii.

with veiler, you can prevent the token summoning and the LaDD, even before you've made even your first move.

i admire your outside-of-the-box thinking tho, but vaskii is nothing but a fun-to-use card...nothing useful...like all reptillianes. (that's my second-favorite archtype, btw, but i'm a realist...or pessimist...? who knows the difference of that lol)


TL;DR:
siding a card specifically to counter ONE SINGLE card never was and never will be a good idea.

I have a question, why argue about how many cards can stop one card?

Lots of card can stop other cards.

I may be getting the wrong vibe off this topic though...

*sigh* yeah it doesn't matter how many can counter Draccosack, we know of the options. Also, I haven't seen people go for LaDD with e-Drags in a while, that was one of the older tricks people don't really use as much anymore.

The fact still remains that Vaskii is a good counter AND aggressive card against e-drags. Compuls/veiler may stop them for that one play, but it doesn't give you any advantage. Even with veiler, thats a -1 for you and they still have a 2600 beater. Vaskii gets rid of it, giving you a +3 in all technicalities AND you got a free 2600 beater on board for tributing their tokens. This allows you to push for game a lot easier and faster, which is THE best thing to have going against e-drags.

Congrats, you compuls'd their first draccosack. Compuls gave you no extra advantage on your side of the field though, and next turn they're just gonna make another draccosack. The point to Vaskii is its counter-aggressive nature. E-drags win within 1-3 turns usually, or at least if they have the advantage during the first 3 turns, you can pretty much say they're gonna win. The game right now isn't about countering your opponent, it's about who can OTK first.

wauwi wrote:also, if you manage to get vaskii out, unless you OTK, he/she's on the opponent's side the next turn, because of big-eye.

And if you played any other monster on your turn, unless you OTK, the opponent is just gonna take whatever else you summoned.... Vaskii is free for you to get out, at least I didnt waste my normal summon just to get the monster I normal summoned stolen....

Niko327 wrote:*sigh* yeah it doesn't matter how many can counter Draccosack, we know of the options. Also, I haven't seen people go for LaDD with e-Drags in a while, that was one of the older tricks people don't really use as much anymore.

The fact still remains that Vaskii is a good counter AND aggressive card against e-drags. Compuls/veiler may stop them for that one play, but it doesn't give you any advantage. Even with veiler, thats a -1 for you and they still have a 2600 beater. Vaskii gets rid of it, giving you a +3 in all technicalities AND you got a free 2600 beater on board for tributing their tokens. This allows you to push for game a lot easier and faster, which is THE best thing to have going against e-drags.

Congrats, you compuls'd their first draccosack. Compuls gave you no extra advantage on your side of the field though, and next turn they're just gonna make another draccosack. The point to Vaskii is its counter-aggressive nature. E-drags win within 1-3 turns usually, or at least if they have the advantage during the first 3 turns, you can pretty much say they're gonna win. The game right now isn't about countering your opponent, it's about who can OTK first.

wauwi wrote:also, if you manage to get vaskii out, unless you OTK, he/she's on the opponent's side the next turn, because of big-eye.

And if you played any other monster on your turn, unless you OTK, the opponent is just gonna take whatever else you summoned.... Vaskii is free for you to get out, at least I didnt waste my normal summon just to get the monster I normal summoned stolen....

Seriously, we know how much can stop DaD, LaDD, BLS Envoy, JD, CED,DSF, and all these other broken cards.

Doesn't change the fact they are extremely powerful and the player usually has a counter to protect it.

I never send my Void Ogre out without a Barrier or Break.(Fernity pun)

Niko327 wrote:

wauwi wrote:also, if you manage to get vaskii out, unless you OTK, he/she's on the opponent's side the next turn, because of big-eye.

And if you played any other monster on your turn, unless you OTK, the opponent is just gonna take whatever else you summoned.... Vaskii is free for you to get out, at least I didnt waste my normal summon just to get the monster I normal summoned stolen....

then you get the monster you normal summoned destroyed by a stolen vaskii (by effect if it's face-up)...or both your normal summon and vaskii stolen by 2 big-eyes...and he still got enough resources to summon another 2 rank 7's...
don't even think about trying to beat lamerulers with anything but lamerulers, verz, d.d. anti SP (both d.d. and verz with a bit of luck) or lamebooks.

we could prove our opinions the ygo-world-way...in a duel.
my lamedragon deck, that i've build in less than a minute without previous knowledge about them against your deck with vaskii/s put in. :moonie:

wauwi wrote:

Niko327 wrote:

wauwi wrote:also, if you manage to get vaskii out, unless you OTK, he/she's on the opponent's side the next turn, because of big-eye.

And if you played any other monster on your turn, unless you OTK, the opponent is just gonna take whatever else you summoned.... Vaskii is free for you to get out, at least I didnt waste my normal summon just to get the monster I normal summoned stolen....

then you get the monster you normal summoned destroyed by a stolen vaskii (by effect if it's face-up)...or both your normal summon and vaskii stolen by 2 big-eyes...and he still got enough resources to summon another 2 rank 7's...
don't even think about trying to beat lamerulers with anything but lamerulers, verz, d.d. anti SP (both d.d. and verz with a bit of luck) or lamebooks.

we could prove our opinions the ygo-world-way...in a duel.
my lamedragon deck, that i've build in less than a minute without previous knowledge about them against your deck with vaskii/s put in. :moonie:

Now this would be fun to watch.

And it would prove a point, but mostly it will be fun to watch.

i just wanna duel someone from TWA for once...but most ppl are using DN...and i don't.

wouldn't actually prove much...i mean, it's possible to not draw vaskii while i have a dracossack...or vice versa...it's a luck 'n chances kind of thing i guess.

wauwi wrote:i just wanna duel someone from TWA for once...but most ppl are using DN...and i don't.

wouldn't actually prove much...i mean, it's possible to not draw vaskii while i have a dracossack...or vice versa...it's a luck 'n chances kind of thing i guess.

Yeah I would love to, but it is a luck thing if I actually were to draw it, plus I've been only using Infernities this format, and Vaskii would be a terrible card to run in it even knowing I'm playing against e-drags. If it gets stuck in my hand.... I'm done lol.

Ok. I would like to prove some points wrong as a long time E-Drag player.

@wauwi:
1. Dracossack is mostly summoned Turn 1 or in the Main Phase 1. People rarely summon it during the Main Phase 2 since... what the hell do you attack with in the BP? Sure you can attack with E-Dragons summoned by their own effects, but you have absolutely no protection and might just end up wasting your cards.
2. Reasons why Compulsory is worse than Vaskii:
- 2 turns to set up.
- Doesn't get rid of tokens.
- By the time you activate it the opponent will already have another Dracossack on the field.
- No free 2600 ATK beatstick = no OTK.
Sure it's more versatile in general but overall Vaskii is better if you know what's coming at you.
Vaskii is a side deck card while Compulse isn't, but then again WHO in E-Dragons mains any traps other than Breakthrough Skill and (Maybe) Eradicator? Yup. No one (good at the game).
3. A common 1st turn for E-Drags WAS Dracossack no Tokens + LaDD. Another 1st turn was Dracossack 1 token + LaDD (if possible), so that dracos wouldn't be destroyed by LaDD's effect while you still got your summon. But LaDD is obsolete and no one that ever plays matches mains it anymore. It might be good to play in singles though.
4. Mind Control won't do jack for you. You just get 2 tokens from Dracossack's effect. Then what?
5. Not a lot of decks can get out Big Eye as consistently as E-Dragons (namely Prophecy, Tempest Dragunity, 3/4-axis Fire Fist, etc.)
6. E-dragon players have a Dracossack on the field 80% of the time. If you draw a Vaskii with no Dracossack on the field, you simply wait for them to summon one then make your big plays and OTK.
7. Why the cards you stated aren't as good vs Dracossack:
Fiendish: so you negate Dracossack's effect. Good luck getting a 2650+ beatstick on the field after you do. Or, hell, have fun having your other cards popped by Dracossack's own effect (yes it can tribute itself).
Chalice: same as Fiendish, but you give it an additional 400 ATK. Nice!
Compuls: read above.
Veiler: same as Fiendish.
Big Eye: read above.
Mind Control: read above.
Solemn: waste 2000/half of your LP to negate a Dracossack summon. Guess what's coming next? Another Dracossack! Totally worth the cost, amirite?
BTH: Good luck getting rid of a Dracossack 1st turn with Bottomless.
Torrential: Same as BTH.
Constellar Pleiades: Only Constellars can get that out fairly easily...
Verz Ophion: How is this even a counter? o_O It doesn't stop Dracossack from being summoned if they already have 2 rulers on the field, and it also doesn't have more ATK than Dracossack. Good luck getting rid of it with only an Ophion on the field.
8. Anything can beat E-Dragons as long as you get the cards and/or outsmart them. Namely: Anti-Meta (can't special summon trololo), any "lockdown" deck (trololo Master Key Beetle + Safe Zone, or, trololo Obelisk. How are you gonna get rid of it if your only out is dark hole? No one mains Dark Hole anymore!), any deck that can bring out Lv 8 Synchros easily (Crimson Blader), Tempest Dragunity (Traps + Crimson Blader), Bujin(War God) (Traps + 4 honests), Constellars (traps + Pleiades), hell even Umbralis if you're good enough at the game (and have a good build).
9. Get DN, it's better. -____-

@Niko:
1. No one mains MST anymore, they just side it.

...and yeah you were right on everything else. :|

I'm done! : D

Granted that you are right Sy, I still have my doubts that Vaskii can consistently stop Draco-sack...

I mean the only time they're going to have two tokens on the field consistently is during turn 1, after which (if you happen to draw it) you can use Vaskii to sack Draco-sack (lol).
But what happens when you draw it mid-game or late game?
There's a good chance they used Draco's effect to pop one token and one of your cards.
I mean, unless you leave your field completely empty so that Draco can't pop anything. And I'm sure that's such a fantastic idea against a deck that can spam 2500+ beaters until their field is full...

Syrufit wrote:Ok. I would like to prove some points wrong as a long time E-Drag player.

@wauwi:
1. Dracossack is mostly summoned Turn 1 or in the Main Phase 1. People rarely summon it during the Main Phase 2 since... what the hell do you attack with in the BP? Sure you can attack with E-Dragons summoned by their own effects, but you have absolutely no protection and might just end up wasting your cards.
2. Reasons why Compulsory is worse than Vaskii:
- 2 turns to set up.
- Doesn't get rid of tokens.
- By the time you activate it the opponent will already have another Dracossack on the field.
- No free 2600 ATK beatstick = no OTK.
Sure it's more versatile in general but overall Vaskii is better if you know what's coming at you.
Vaskii is a side deck card while Compulse isn't, but then again WHO in E-Dragons mains any traps other than Breakthrough Skill and (Maybe) Eradicator? Yup. No one (good at the game).
3. A common 1st turn for E-Drags WAS Dracossack no Tokens + LaDD. Another 1st turn was Dracossack 1 token + LaDD (if possible), so that dracos wouldn't be destroyed by LaDD's effect while you still got your summon. But LaDD is obsolete and no one that ever plays matches mains it anymore. It might be good to play in singles though.
4. Mind Control won't do jack for you. You just get 2 tokens from Dracossack's effect. Then what?
5. Not a lot of decks can get out Big Eye as consistently as E-Dragons (namely Prophecy, Tempest Dragunity, 3/4-axis Fire Fist, etc.)
6. E-dragon players have a Dracossack on the field 80% of the time. If you draw a Vaskii with no Dracossack on the field, you simply wait for them to summon one then make your big plays and OTK.
7. Why the cards you stated aren't as good vs Dracossack:
Fiendish: so you negate Dracossack's effect. Good luck getting a 2650+ beatstick on the field after you do. Or, hell, have fun having your other cards popped by Dracossack's own effect (yes it can tribute itself).
Chalice: same as Fiendish, but you give it an additional 400 ATK. Nice!
Compuls: read above.
Veiler: same as Fiendish.
Big Eye: read above.
Mind Control: read above.
Solemn: waste 2000/half of your LP to negate a Dracossack summon. Guess what's coming next? Another Dracossack! Totally worth the cost, amirite?
BTH: Good luck getting rid of a Dracossack 1st turn with Bottomless.
Torrential: Same as BTH.
Constellar Pleiades: Only Constellars can get that out fairly easily...
Verz Ophion: How is this even a counter? o_O It doesn't stop Dracossack from being summoned if they already have 2 rulers on the field, and it also doesn't have more ATK than Dracossack. Good luck getting rid of it with only an Ophion on the field.
8. Anything can beat E-Dragons as long as you get the cards and/or outsmart them. Namely: Anti-Meta (can't special summon trololo), any "lockdown" deck (trololo Master Key Beetle + Safe Zone, or, trololo Obelisk. How are you gonna get rid of it if your only out is dark hole? No one mains Dark Hole anymore!), any deck that can bring out Lv 8 Synchros easily (Crimson Blader), Tempest Dragunity (Traps + Crimson Blader), Bujin(War God) (Traps + 4 honests), Constellars (traps + Pleiades), hell even Umbralis if you're good enough at the game (and have a good build).
9. Get DN, it's better. -____-

@Niko:
1. No one mains MST anymore, they just side it.

...and yeah you were right on everything else. :|

I'm done! : D

Syrufit too sexy for his shirt, so sexy it hurts!!!!

Damn, that wall of text destroys arguments.

@Ehero:
You're forgetting Dracossack can't attack if they pop a card. What I've seen done a lot is: Summon dracossack, eff summon 2 tokens, tribute, pop, summon another dracossack, tribute, pop, then use eff to summon 2 more tokens and push for game next turn. Vaskii gets rid of the tokens and both Dracossacks (or just 1, if you don't want to attack into the other).

@ Sy:
about mind control: you forget that you can activate his eff after summoning tokens to destroy himself and an opponents card.
about veiler: if it's in your starting hand while you opponent first turns draco, you can troll him nicely with her.

well, you still didn't destroyed my main argument: all cards (and about one million other potential dracossack killers) are, unlike vaskii, versatile, while vaskii is recommended a counter by the OP for one single card only.
it would also pretty much only works against e-dragons...i mean i know no other deck which summons rank 7's so frequently, other than maybe harpie's (well, they summon 0-2 per duel from what i've seen)

and that's why siding vaskii would be a bad idea, he takes precious side-deck space, while in your side-deck and precious main-deck space while in your main deck and if you draw it without an actual dracossack out? well, you can wait for one, but a smart player rather destroys a facedown (monster or trap/spell) with draco, then just attacking and leaves just 1 token on the field.

throw in improsining mirrors, iron walls (against those annoying double D's) stardust/starlightroad or "my body as a shield", forbidden quickspells...or wait...some people running cyber dragon+chimeratech fortress dragon in their side decks...THAT would be like the best dracossack killer - no draco, no tokens and you got a nice little 4k ATK steamroller.

and if there's no draco, and you have no monsters, but your opponent does, it's still a nice little instant level 5, 2100ATK and might result in you having a rank5 XYZ, if your deck runs other easy-to-summon level 5 mosnters. (for example, instant fusion, the tricky, etc)

oh and btw, get YGOPro (percy), it comes without trolling, flaming and ruling arguments. :0o0o0:

Mind Control:
Target 1 monster your opponent controls; until the End Phase, take control of that target, but it cannot declare an attack or be Tributed.

Also you do not seem to get my point so I won't bother explaining it again.

dracossack does not tribute and if i destroy him and one of the opponent cards, he won't be able to attack anyways...

oh and cyber+chimeratech would also be great against those annoying zenmaines (and any other machine monster)...i love that card, as long as it fights for me.

i get your point...i just don't see it that way...you donÄt seem to get mine. :/

Once per turn: You can Tribute 1 "Mecha Phantom Beast" monster, then target 1 card on the field; destroy that target. This card cannot attack during the turn you activate this effect.

Please read cards before stating facts.

sry just read it up on the wikia, my bad. (bad wauwi)

you still can tribute a token tho.